Final Fantasy XV - General News Thread

[stolas]

Ummm why wouldn't it happen? It's not like it's going to be costing them anything. lol

It does cost them money. They have to pay a team of people to integrate it back into the game. That involves basic things like modeling, texturing, dynamics, and then more complicated stuff like programing and debugging. The funding for FFXV content has been over since they decided to cut 3 out of the 4 DLCs and cut content that was advertised for Comrades like the super boss raids and the fight with Matsuda. The only reason why we are getting Ardyn because it's assets were already made. It seems that Pre-invaded Insomnia had been finished or at least a chunk of it since a rendered image was included in Dossier that was added last year. They aren't going to make any new models other than Somnus and the Glaives which were likely just quickly created with their Character Creator. You can see from the trailer alone that there is a drop in quality.

Edit: Again if it was that easy they would have added/ restored way more for the Royal Edition to justify that price tag, like the train station scene that was cut in Chapter 10 ( you can see what it would have looked like when they showed the cat cam trailer), the rumored nearly finished Shiva dungeon, and Tenebrae sequence or even the Bros with their own skill trees like what was seen in early ATBs when they showed off the leveling system. The only reason why we got the FFXIV and Terra Wars collab was because those assets were either done, close to being finished, or reused. With the Terra Collab there are two new models. That's it. One of them is extremely simple geometry. For FFXIV everything was reused assets from that title that was imported in minus the weapons and the clothing which we know at least the the clothing was modeled way before. Even the new summon we got is a reskin of the FFXIV version with alterations and a new texture slapped on. It was so quickly done that they didn't finish the weight painting for the animation rig. Look at her feet, there's geometry sticking out because it wasn't finished. If they add in the Memory Forest with those cutscenes or deathgaze, great, I'm not going to object but seeing how this installment was handled and seeing how they cancelled a huge chunk of stuff because they don't want to fund the project anymore I wouldn't be surprised if its just a compatibility patch so whatever you get from completing Episode Ardyn can be added to the main game. I'm guessing those starscourge daggers that were supposed to be for Episode Ignis.

 

[NikoZ]

It does cost them money. They have to pay a team of people to integrate it back into the game. That involves basic things like modeling, texturing, dynamics, and then more complicated stuff like programing and debugging. The funding for FFXV content has been over since they decided to cut 3 out of the 4 DLCs and cut content that was advertised for Comrades like the super boss raids and the fight with Matsuda. The only reason why we are getting Ardyn because it's assets were already made. It seems that Pre-invaded Insomnia had been finished or at least a chunk of it since a rendered image was included in Dossier that was added last year. They aren't going to make any new model's other than Somnus and the Glaives which were likely just quickly created with their Character Creator. You can see from the trailer alone that there is a drop in quality.

Hmmm. I see your point. There's no point in arguing honestly. Let's just stay realistically optimistic about it and we'll see what'll happen

 

[Ikkin]

It does cost them money. They have to pay a team of people to integrate it back into the game. That involves basic things like modeling, texturing, dynamics, and then more complicated stuff like programing and debugging. The funding for FFXV content has been over since they decided to cut 3 out of the 4 DLCs and cut content that was advertised for Comrades like the super boss raids and the fight with Matsuda. The only reason why we are getting Ardyn because it's assets were already made. It seems that Pre-invaded Insomnia had been finished or at least a chunk of it since a rendered image was included in Dossier that was added last year. They aren't going to make any new models other than Somnus and the Glaives which were likely just quickly created with their Character Creator. You can see from the trailer alone that there is a drop in quality.

Based on the datamine, though, it seems like a lot of the most expensive stuff has already been done. For the additional playable character, at least, there are gifs of the animations (which don't look quite right, not because they weren't finished, but because the game's clothing animation system is separate in a way that makes it difficult to render properly into a gif) and audio files of the combat calls. Debugging is a cost, but it's a cost they were willing to pay for things like the Terra Wars collab that weren't on the top of people's wish lists.

It's less clear how much would need to be done on the memory forest, but the same was true of the Terra Battle and FFXIV collabs when they were first uncovered, and those were finished. There's certainly little reason to think the remaining content would require more work than those collabs.

 

[LeonBlade]

Based on the datamine, though, it seems like a lot of the most expensive stuff has already been done. For the additional playable character, at least, there are gifs of the animations (which don't look quite right, not because they weren't finished, but because the game's clothing animation system is separate in a way that makes it difficult to render properly into a gif) and audio files of the combat calls. Debugging is a cost, but it's a cost they were willing to pay for things like the Terra Wars collab that weren't on the top of people's wish lists.

It's less clear how much would need to be done on the memory forest, but the same was true of the Terra Battle and FFXIV collabs when they were first uncovered, and those were finished. There's certainly little reason to think the remaining content would require more work than those collabs.

We have no way of knowing what's finished and what isn't. Terra Battle's collab was just environments, cutscenes and regular battles. Anything new is vastly different and requires more work.

 

[Ikkin]

We have no way of knowing what's finished and what isn't. Terra Battle's collab was just environments, cutscenes and regular battles. Anything new is vastly different and requires more work.

I wouldn't say "no way of knowing."

Spoiler

We have this gif as proof that Luna's combat animations exist in the unused files that exist:

https://twitter.com/statuses/1064892386420146183

And an unofficial translation of the Japanese tutorial for playing as Luna, including the ability to summon Bahamut:
https://pastebin.com/ENJJd4vX

As the Tweet suggests, the combat voiceover appears to have been recorded back before the game was even released.

All indications suggest that work was done on implementing Luna in combat on several different occasions. It's also worth noting that Luna and Bahamut featured heavily in promotional media for the Royal Edition, which strongly suggests that the removal of that content was a last-minute decision (and hence that the content was probably near-complete when it was cut). The obvious culprit, as the Tweet implies, is the decision to create an Episode Luna.

Not to mention, both the Terra Wars and FFXIV collaborations were able to add party members (and, in the latter case, summons) without any apparent difficulty. The associated quest didn't sound particularly asset-heavy, so reinstating a party member that they had attempted to add on two previous occasions couldn't possibly be more work than finishing the collaborations.

I'm entirely willing to question whether we're going to see the memory forest... but there's absolutely no reason why the party member in question shouldn't be completed without much further investment.

 

[Lord_Ham_Mork]

Me: Definetly we're are going to get a cool final expantion.
[Reads comments]
Me: We have clearly being left behind and I don't have any hope for the future of this title.
[Reads again]
Me again: Come on guys, we're gonna have an amazing final Bang with plenty of content to enjoy!
[Repeat
.
.
.]

 

[stolas]

Me: Definetly we're are going to get a cool final expantion.
[Reads comments]
Me: We have clearly being left behind and I don't have any hope for the future of this title.
[Reads again]
Me again: Come on guys, we're gonna have an amazing final Bang with plenty of content to enjoy!
[Repeat
.
.
.]

ha, I have the same feeling.
So let's pretend they give us Luna as a playable character, wouldn't it be just restricted to Chapter 14 then and the time skip in Chapter 15? Lore-wise and logically you can't put her anywhere else because how they wrote out her story for Chapter 14, hence why she they didn't add her in the Royal Update to begin with. They basically have her only assist in summoning the Astrals then she disappears again. Which, side note, felt like really bad fan fiction; it took away from the principles of how death works (compare it to how they handled Aerith in the original FFVII story, not the expanded plot) and ruined Bahamut's entrance in Ifrit's fight. If they were going to add playable characters to at least the end game wouldn't it be more logical to add, Aranea, Cor, and Iris because that makes sense story wise?

 

[LeonBlade]

I wouldn't say "no way of knowing."

Spoiler

We have this gif as proof that Luna's combat animations exist in the unused files that exist:

https://twitter.com/statuses/1064892386420146183

And an unofficial translation of the Japanese tutorial for playing as Luna, including the ability to summon Bahamut:
https://pastebin.com/ENJJd4vX

As the Tweet suggests, the combat voiceover appears to have been recorded back before the game was even released.

All indications suggest that work was done on implementing Luna in combat on several different occasions. It's also worth noting that Luna and Bahamut featured heavily in promotional media for the Royal Edition, which strongly suggests that the removal of that content was a last-minute decision (and hence that the content was probably near-complete when it was cut). The obvious culprit, as the Tweet implies, is the decision to create an Episode Luna.

Not to mention, both the Terra Wars and FFXIV collaborations were able to add party members (and, in the latter case, summons) without any apparent difficulty. The associated quest didn't sound particularly asset-heavy, so reinstating a party member that they had attempted to add on two previous occasions couldn't possibly be more work than finishing the collaborations.

I'm entirely willing to question whether we're going to see the memory forest... but there's absolutely no reason why the party member in question shouldn't be completed without much further investment.

We know some things exist because of some datamined files, but who is to say they would even use those files or what else is done or not done that wasn't added into the game.

Regardless, as I mentioned, these things aren't free. Even though assets exist, it doesn't mean anything. If that were the case, we would have had a lot more like the train station added into the game, but instead they cut it and it hasn't been added back in since nor do I think it ever will.

 

[Nova]

Regardless, as I mentioned, these things aren't free.

We've gotten notable additions from updates that were free though. Unless you meant having enough budget to make them? Which in case while i'd agree to an extent, I doubt the resource and cost for including a party member are extraordinarily high especially if enough progress was indeed made to bring it back.

Even though assets exist, it doesn't mean anything.

Nothing is guaranteed, but its technically a fact that we've received a couple of stuff that were found in the datamine that eventually made it into the main game. Not all, but some that make examples of what else could feasibly join suit not entirely out of the team of possibility.

If that were the case, we would have had a lot more like the train station added into the game, but instead they cut it and it hasn't been added back in since nor do I think it ever will.

Tbf finishing an additional party member vs recreating assets from an unfinished area to that degree aren't exactly comparatively similar in regards to resources and what could potentially work with the time the team are given. I don't think anyone was under the assumption that any other content that exists via datamine automatically means it could come back too, hence feasibility.

Make no mistake, my expectations atm are rather low and the other possibility of pending content being axed outside of EP. Ardyn for March is a very likely scenario. I'm just looking at this other way around.

 

[Ikkin]

ha, I have the same feeling.
So let's pretend they give us Luna as a playable character, wouldn't it be just restricted to Chapter 14 then and the time skip in Chapter 15? Lore-wise and logically you can't put her anywhere else because how they wrote out her story for Chapter 14, hence why she they didn't add her in the Royal Update to begin with. They basically have her only assist in summoning the Astrals then she disappears again. Which, side note, felt like really bad fan fiction; it took away from the principles of how death works (compare it to how they handled Aerith in the original FFVII story, not the expanded plot) and ruined Bahamut's entrance in Ifrit's fight. If they were going to add playable characters to at least the end game wouldn't it be more logical to add, Aranea, Cor, and Iris because that makes sense story wise?

If Luna is added as a party member, it would almost certainly be a post-game thing, yeah. I don't think that's a reason not to do it, though; they added plenty of "impossible" things into the post-game already, like the Regalia Type-F and the Adamantoise fight (and, I think, the Regalia Replica?), so it wouldn't be that strange for playable Luna to end up the same way.

Re: the way death works, having Luna appear the way she did actually makes the ending considerably less ambiguous, since it makes it clear that, yes, there is an afterlife and yes, people who are there can still interact with the living world. FFXV doesn't need to be a world where dead people's souls get recycled for death to matter.

We know some things exist because of some datamined files, but who is to say they would even use those files or what else is done or not done that wasn't added into the game.

Well, knowing that something is in the datamine says an awful lot given how many of the significant additions in the datamine ended up being used in the end. Sure, there were some really old things from earlier battle systems, too, but the things that I'm talking about were either labeled GOTY (and therefore originally meant to be part of the Royal Edition) or written up in the same way as the collaborations were (I initially assumed that the mysterious forest was part of the Terra Battle 2 collab, actually). We're definitely in a better position that "who knows?" given what's happened so far.

Regardless, as I mentioned, these things aren't free. Even though assets exist, it doesn't mean anything. If that were the case, we would have had a lot more like the train station added into the game, but instead they cut it and it hasn't been added back in since nor do I think it ever will.

They're not free, but they would serve as an excellent final free update to get people back into the game at the same time as Episode Ardyn is releasing. That's the strategy LumiPro has been using all along -- give everyone something free to draw their attention, then go all out for the DLC advertising at the same time. That strategy seems to have been effective so far, given that they were willing to make another four DLCs!

In any case, the train station is a completely different ball of wax, because it no longer has any reasonable place to exist in the world that we know. As far as I can tell, it existed because Altissia originally wasn't on an island, and therefore Noct's train journey started there. Since Altissia is, in fact, an island now, there's nowhere for the train station to go.

Of the two things I've been discussing, there are obvious places for each of them to exist. One of them is a post-game fanservice bonus. The other... well, it depends what the mysterious forest is, but if I were to add something like that, there's an obvious way to do it:

1) Use the unique forest assets from the Platinum Demo for the forest itself
2) Have Noct access the forest in a dream, which can be triggered by a panel in the Cape Caem safehouse
3) Use Carbuncle as a memory viewer
4) Make the memories into video files instead of realtime events

That way, you'd keep the cost low, add in some extra connections to Carbuncle and Noct's sleep motif, and still be able to include the flashbacks that weren't able to exist in the game as it currently exists.

 

[stolas]

If Luna is added as a party member, it would almost certainly be a post-game thing, yeah. I don't think that's a reason not to do it, though; they added plenty of "impossible" things into the post-game already, like the Regalia Type-F and the Adamantoise fight (and, I think, the Regalia Replica?), so it wouldn't be that strange for playable Luna to end up the same way.

Re: the way death works, having Luna appear the way she did actually makes the ending considerably less ambiguous, since it makes it clear that, yes, there is an afterlife and yes, people who are there can still interact with the living world. FFXV doesn't need to be a world where dead people's souls get recycled for death to matter.

Adamantoise and Regalia type F made sense because they could have fit into the world prior to Noctis leaving/ the time skip from a narrative standpoint. The reason why Luna doesn't fit is because she's dead and they never interact with her. And my point about death is that if it happens in a story it needs to be permanent, otherwise what is the point of killing them off if they are going to continue interacting with the party? That's what made Aerith's death successful from a story standpoint, she never interacted with the party again. Having all these interactions and even possible playability cheapens the point of her dying and if this was the case they should have just kept her alive for longer.
Also another reason why they might not throw her in is because of her moveset alone. Didn't she have magics like Aero? If that's not finished and they no longer have the budget I doubt she's getting in. Like with Deathgaze's moveset, it's recycled from what Ardyn can do in which was shown in the Episode Ardyn trailer. Again, at this point it's about being as cost effective as possible.

In any case, the train station is a completely different ball of wax, because it no longer has any reasonable place to exist in the world that we know. As far as I can tell, it existed because Altissia originally wasn't on an island, and therefore Noct's train journey started there. Since Altissia is, in fact, an island now, there's nowhere for the train station to go.

They still end up on a train, so they had to board somewhere.

 

[Lulcielid]

In any case, the train station is a completely different ball of wax, because it no longer has any reasonable place to exist in the world that we know. As far as I can tell, it existed because Altissia originally wasn't on an island, and therefore Noct's train journey started there. Since Altissia is, in fact, an island now, there's nowhere for the train station to go.

They still end up on a train, so they had to board somewhere.

True but is there any reason to make the starting train station playable? Is there enough meat to justify making an area that will be playable for less than two or even than an hour?

 

[CloudBuster]

True but is there any reason to make the starting train station playable? Is there enough meat to justify making an area that will be playable for less than two or even than an hour?

I think a transition cutscene like the one we got for chapter 5 is the only logical route that can be taken at this point what with the budget cuts. Maybe show the boys boarding at the station with an in game cutscene, have Noct be really out of it while the boys are discussing plans and strategy or something like that and Gladio's frustrations start to show a bit due to Noct's unresponsiveness in such a crucial time. Then we skip a few weeks ahead and the big fight on the train happens which now has more context to it. That's the most I can see being done for that section at this point unless Luminous Studios surprise us out of nowhere which is unlikely since in the grand scheme of things the boys boarding the train is pretty unimportant.

As for the Luna stuff I don't think it should be hard to get a small group to go back and revitalize it so that it can be added back in as Ardyn's episode nears the end of its development. The fact that they originally thought RE was it for the game and had her content prepared for it means they must have had a decent amount of it finished and it likely just needs a bit of polish before its ready to be added in. The whole reason it wasn't part of the RE was because they found out close to its release that they would be getting the chance to make a full episode for Luna hence why they held off on putting her in since a better opportunity had presented itself. Also remember that Tabata only got approval for the second season of DLC about a month before the release of RE so that means Luna's stuff would've been removed last minute and would've had a decent amount of work done on it before removal.

Whether the stuff actually gets put back into the game now that Episode Luna is canceled remains to be seen but it really can't be that hard to go back and finish up stuff they already had prepared. Let's not forget that the team is still looking for ways to tell the stories they had planned so who knows if they decide that the best way to tell the Luna story is to go back to the original method that they had planned. Square's upper management has moved on from FFXV but it's clear that the Luminous team is still very much passionate about it if they're still asking fans about how they'd like to see these remaining stories told so I wouldn't count out the possibility of them going back to old stuff and bringing it back.

 

[Vallen]

Happy New Year you butts

Me: Definetly we're are going to get a cool final expantion.
[Reads comments]
Me: We have clearly being left behind and I don't have any hope for the future of this title.
[Reads again]
Me again: Come on guys, we're gonna have an amazing final Bang with plenty of content to enjoy!
[Repeat
.
.
.]

It’s rollercoaster of emotions that’s for sure lol

 

[NikoZ]

So.. how big do we think Insomnia's going to be? The locations shown in the trailer look rather unknown to me. Also Ifrit, if he really is going to be summonable, how realistic is it that they'll put him into the main game?

Also, is Ardyn still going to face the Astrals in his episode? I mean they said so in April

 

[Ikkin]

So.. how big do we think Insomnia's going to be? The locations shown in the trailer look rather unknown to me.

Insomnia was decently large in the Royal Edition, so... I suspect around that size, though the parts we visit might not all be the same.

Also Ifrit, if he really is going to be summonable, how realistic is it that they'll put him into the main game?

Given that playable Ardyn makes no sense at all and they've already added a summon for the FFXIV collab, a post-game Ifrit summon seems like a reasonable completion reward.

Also, is Ardyn still going to face the Astrals in his episode? I mean they said so in April

Did they ever say that Ardyn was going to fight the Astrals, specifically, or just that he's going to oppose them? It's possible that they could be antagonists without necessarily being boss fights.

Spoiler

Someone found the names of the music tracks through a datamine, and I don't remember any Astral but Ifrit being mentioned.

 

[NikoZ]

Insomnia was decently large in the Royal Edition, so... I suspect around that size, though the parts we visit might not all be the same.



Given that playable Ardyn makes no sense at all and they've already added a summon for the FFXIV collab, a post-game Ifrit summon seems like a reasonable completion reward.



Did they ever say that Ardyn was going to fight the Astrals, specifically, or just that he's going to oppose them? It's possible that they could be antagonists without necessarily being boss fights.

Spoiler

Someone found the names of the music tracks through a datamine, and I don't remember any Astral but Ifrit being mentioned.

No no I didn't mean face as in fight hahah.

 

[Cloud_CR]

https://twitter.com/statuses/1080154694192816128

 

[stolas]

Insomnia was decently large in the Royal Edition, so... I suspect around that size, though the parts we visit might not all be the same.



Given that playable Ardyn makes no sense at all and they've already added a summon for the FFXIV collab, a post-game Ifrit summon seems like a reasonable completion reward.

Ifrit is not supposed to be obtainable, hence why his key item is the Infernian Shard vs it being the Infernian Mark like all the other summons. If they haven't added Bahamut yet I doubt they'll add Ifrit. I think what we are getting from Episode Ardyn are those Starscourge daggers found in the datamine and maybe Somnus' attire for Noct. Maybe Ardyn's Shield.

 

[Ikkin]

Ifrit is not supposed to be obtainable, hence why his key item is the Infernian Shard vs it being the Infernian Mark like all the other summons. If they haven't added Bahamut yet I doubt they'll add Ifrit. I think what we are getting from Episode Ardyn are those Starscourge daggers found in the datamine and maybe Somnus' attire for Noct. Maybe Ardyn's Shield.

Well...

Spoiler

According to the datamine, Bahamut was at least considered as a Royal Edition bonus summon, as part of the playable-Luna moveset. So it's entirely possible that we'll get both at approximately the same time.