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NIKKEI predicts that it will sell 1M units.
http://www.dualshockers.com/2016/01...ll-over-a-million-each-despite-console-slump/
http://www.dualshockers.com/2016/01...ll-over-a-million-each-despite-console-slump/
This is what each game has done in Japan so far since Final Fantasy VII. (Media Create numbers archived by Game Data Museum)
FFVII - 3.2 million (3,277,776)
FFVIII - 3.5 million (3,501,588)
FFIX - 2.7 million (2,707,301)
FFX - 2.3 million (2,325,215)
FFX-2 - 1.9 million (1,960,937)
FFXII - 2.3 million (2,322,541)
FFXIII - 1.9 million (1,905,979)
FFXIII-2 - 0.9 million (917,412)
LR:FFXIII - 0.4 million (419,532)
FFXIII did 1.5 million in its first week and 1.9 million is where it settled.
There has been a decline in Japan since FFVII. The question today though is how much of an impact does mobile gaming really have on console gaming in Japan? That will be determined with titles like Final Fantasy XV, Final Fantasy VII Remake and Dragon Quest XI.
FFVII - 3.2 million (3,277,776)
FFVIII - 3.5 million (3,501,588)
FFIX - 2.7 million (2,707,301)
FFX - 2.3 million (2,325,215)
FFX-2 - 1.9 million (1,960,937)
FFXII - 2.3 million (2,322,541)
FFXIII - 1.9 million (1,905,979)
FFXIII-2 - 0.9 million (917,412)
LR:FFXIII - 0.4 million (419,532)
FFXIII did 1.5 million in its first week and 1.9 million is where it settled.
There has been a decline in Japan since FFVII. The question today though is how much of an impact does mobile gaming really have on console gaming in Japan? That will be determined with titles like Final Fantasy XV, Final Fantasy VII Remake and Dragon Quest XI.
Likes:
APZonerunner
Mayhaps not saving, but I feel that FF needs to find a course it can stay on for a while right now. For the last fifteen years, the games have always been radically different from another and I firmly believe this was in part responsible for the decline of faith put into the series by the players. Think about it - X was a major departure from how the series worked for the bigger part of a decade, X-2 changed things up again, as did XII and XIII and XV will be different again, not withholding the fact that there were also two MMOs in that timespan. Now, experimenting is fine and dandy, but it needs to stop at some point to refine the results it yielded - right now, FF is standing at a large crossroads, trying out various paths but never committing to one to see how far it can lead.
Sand off the edges from the stuff that worked in XV (gameplay-wise, change the setting as much as you like), throw in maybe a new ability system et voilà. Trying to make every game vastly different (including the engine) cuts the time better spent on the stuff I feel shaped the first nine games into the classics and genre touchstones they are revered as.
Sand off the edges from the stuff that worked in XV (gameplay-wise, change the setting as much as you like), throw in maybe a new ability system et voilà. Trying to make every game vastly different (including the engine) cuts the time better spent on the stuff I feel shaped the first nine games into the classics and genre touchstones they are revered as.
Likes:
dissasterrific
"Innovation" does not necessarily need to happen on a larger scale. Think of it as trying to forcibly reinvent the car everytime you've built it instead of grabbing ideas from the last time and tweaking things from there. It takes far too much time to do it over than to fail and build from the things that can work.
I actually think that's what they're going to do from here on out. XVI may offer something similar to XV.
I actually think that's what they're going to do from here on out. XVI may offer something similar to XV.
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I don't think they'll use the same battle system from XV in XVI though, that's the thing, I imagine something more like XII for XVI just as a wild guess, obviously could be completely wrong.
I think a better comparison is instead of updating the same model vehicle each year with new parts and slightly different designs, you create a completely new model of car meant for different types of drivers, not reinventing the car from scratch. XV is like a brand new model by the same company, a luxury car that goes fast, but ultimately has similar core features to their other models that lend to the fact they are from the same dealer.
I think a better comparison is instead of updating the same model vehicle each year with new parts and slightly different designs, you create a completely new model of car meant for different types of drivers, not reinventing the car from scratch. XV is like a brand new model by the same company, a luxury car that goes fast, but ultimately has similar core features to their other models that lend to the fact they are from the same dealer.
Likes:
dissasterrific
I'm typing up my reply before reading everyone else's opinions, so apologies if I'm just echoing someone.
This is a landmark title, no matter how you slice it. I don't think they specifically went out to make the next FF title an ARPG. I think they were in the process of rebuilding from the confidence blow that was FFXIII and FFXIV 1.0, saw the potential in this game and decided to go all in on it. However, make no mistake, this IS the new Final Fantasy, assuming the game is a success (and while nothing is bullet proof, this game has almost no chance of being a commercial or critical bomb. It could be meidocre, but it's got a very high floor).
This is a punt on the old generation. There's no need to pander to us anymore, we're getting old and the parts of the fanbase that are more vocal about wanting things to be how they were a decade or two ago aren't going to be satisfied no matter what they do. They're moving on to the next generation, and it's either time to get on board or get left behind. This may sound harsh to some perfectly wonderful people that just wish things are the way they were but it's over. It's done.
To reverse this tide would require an complete, outight bomb in FFXV, and that's just not going to happen. It's too pretty to fail. It's perfectly timed for the consoles with the general lack of JRPG-esque games as well. It's the anti-FFXIII. They hit this from every single angle. It's going to sell. And being a gorgeous open-world game means it's going to get its share of good reviews. All it needs to do to set the direction for all future titles is to beat FFXIII. Does anyone here think this game will be less successful than FFXIII, either critically or commercially? It's done.
I've mentioned this in other places before, and it's just plain the truth. Turn based isn't dead, but it will never be the forefront again. There's just nothing left to prove, and make no mistake the numbered FF series is about benchmarking. You simply can't max out today's consoles with a turn based game. You can, however, still show off what you're capable of on handheld consoles, which is why they've migrated there. You will also have a wave of neo-nostlagic titles like I am Setsuna, but FFXVI, XVII and XVIII are already ARPG, they just don't know it yet.
This is a landmark title, no matter how you slice it. I don't think they specifically went out to make the next FF title an ARPG. I think they were in the process of rebuilding from the confidence blow that was FFXIII and FFXIV 1.0, saw the potential in this game and decided to go all in on it. However, make no mistake, this IS the new Final Fantasy, assuming the game is a success (and while nothing is bullet proof, this game has almost no chance of being a commercial or critical bomb. It could be meidocre, but it's got a very high floor).
This is a punt on the old generation. There's no need to pander to us anymore, we're getting old and the parts of the fanbase that are more vocal about wanting things to be how they were a decade or two ago aren't going to be satisfied no matter what they do. They're moving on to the next generation, and it's either time to get on board or get left behind. This may sound harsh to some perfectly wonderful people that just wish things are the way they were but it's over. It's done.
To reverse this tide would require an complete, outight bomb in FFXV, and that's just not going to happen. It's too pretty to fail. It's perfectly timed for the consoles with the general lack of JRPG-esque games as well. It's the anti-FFXIII. They hit this from every single angle. It's going to sell. And being a gorgeous open-world game means it's going to get its share of good reviews. All it needs to do to set the direction for all future titles is to beat FFXIII. Does anyone here think this game will be less successful than FFXIII, either critically or commercially? It's done.
I've mentioned this in other places before, and it's just plain the truth. Turn based isn't dead, but it will never be the forefront again. There's just nothing left to prove, and make no mistake the numbered FF series is about benchmarking. You simply can't max out today's consoles with a turn based game. You can, however, still show off what you're capable of on handheld consoles, which is why they've migrated there. You will also have a wave of neo-nostlagic titles like I am Setsuna, but FFXVI, XVII and XVIII are already ARPG, they just don't know it yet.
Likes:
dissasterrific and Koozek
Exactly. And we as "old" fans can either adapt and be open for new things, or just stop caring. I choose the former and I can't wait to see what new things they'll try in the future with the mainline titles.
It's hilarious (and more often than not pitiful) how some people are posting "SE doesn't make good FFs anymore, FF is dead!" for nearly 15 (!) years now. At some point it seems crazy desperate if you're still obviously emotionally invested enough to claim that you "don't even care anymore" all the time. Let it go.
It's hilarious (and more often than not pitiful) how some people are posting "SE doesn't make good FFs anymore, FF is dead!" for nearly 15 (!) years now. At some point it seems crazy desperate if you're still obviously emotionally invested enough to claim that you "don't even care anymore" all the time. Let it go.
Likes:
dissasterrific and DrBretto
Furthermore, if this game ends up being the way I'm projecting (and I have been remarkably accurate in my guesses for this game so far, and this goes back fro months), then this game will play a little bit differently from anything else that's out there, and I do believe it will set a new style much the same way they did with the prerendered backgrounds in FFVII.
This isn't to give FFXV all the credit because they've borrowed from plenty of other landmark titles, that's just how these things work, but this will be the game that many, many future titles are compared to. And there will be a lot of games that use the same storytelling mechanics.
This part is the big if part, and that's totally up for interpretation. I stand by my prediction that there is almost no chance the project is deemed a failure, but this post is assuming the project is a wild success, which is very much on the table. This game has Instant Classic written all over it.
This isn't to give FFXV all the credit because they've borrowed from plenty of other landmark titles, that's just how these things work, but this will be the game that many, many future titles are compared to. And there will be a lot of games that use the same storytelling mechanics.
This part is the big if part, and that's totally up for interpretation. I stand by my prediction that there is almost no chance the project is deemed a failure, but this post is assuming the project is a wild success, which is very much on the table. This game has Instant Classic written all over it.
Likes:
dissasterrific
Yeah, I totally understand that the new direction isn't for everyone, but some people should jsut have moved on a long time ago. I just had a similar conversation with someone about this. FFXV has been a confirmed ARPG for almost 4 years. People need to stop acting surprised about it. If you haven't liked a FF game since FFX, then stop following the franchise and start playing fan mods.
Me, personally, I grew up on the series. But, I'm ready for the next one.
Me, personally, I grew up on the series. But, I'm ready for the next one.
Likes:
LeonBlade and Koozek
I couldn't agree more with this statement. I'm especially bothered by some fans who just cannot let go of the turn-based system. It's not even an exaggeration, it's still being loudly stated in most spaces of FF discussion online. It's like they never want the series to ever evolve! As Hashimoto himself said in an old interview, the next mainline titles won't necessarily be ARPGs, but at the same time I also think that the systems will inevitably have heavier action elements at the very least from now on.
As to how I think XV will affect the franchise, I simply see it to be another appropriate entry that showcases the series' ability to reinvent itself. There's not much more to be said for now when we know very little, and perhaps I'll get a better idea on the 30th.
As to how I think XV will affect the franchise, I simply see it to be another appropriate entry that showcases the series' ability to reinvent itself. There's not much more to be said for now when we know very little, and perhaps I'll get a better idea on the 30th.
Likes:
LeonBlade and DrBretto
I don't care at all about turn-based combat and it's the last reason why I hold so many old jRPGs near and dear. The two jRPG I count as my personal number ones for the last console generation are The Last Story and Xenoblade Chronicles - neither game is turn-based, but semi-real-time with TLS offering a cover-based action combat system and XC being mostly comparable to FF XII - a game I will defend whenever I can btw because I think the combat is really, really good.
I love Chrono Trigger, Lufia II: Rise of the Sinistrals, Gensou Suikoden and (most of) the pre-X FFs because I love the stories they tell and the characters in them. I can accept turn-based being relegated to the niche (although two insanely successful franchises, Square's own Dragon Quest and Pokémon still use them) and I think the reasoning that jRPG don't resonate as much anymore is because the turn-based systems aren't around is a major fallacy on behalf of both the people who defend turn-based combat and those who think it a relic of the past better cast aside.
I love Chrono Trigger, Lufia II: Rise of the Sinistrals, Gensou Suikoden and (most of) the pre-X FFs because I love the stories they tell and the characters in them. I can accept turn-based being relegated to the niche (although two insanely successful franchises, Square's own Dragon Quest and Pokémon still use them) and I think the reasoning that jRPG don't resonate as much anymore is because the turn-based systems aren't around is a major fallacy on behalf of both the people who defend turn-based combat and those who think it a relic of the past better cast aside.
Likes:
Koozek
I agree that it's not so cut an dry. When people are talking about turn based like it's a relic from the past, this is more of a result of TB fans turning this into some kind of a territory war. Most of the people who are OK with the changes aren't necessarily pro-ARPG so much as they aren't anti-change, and some of the more vocal complainers about the state of TB are absolutely just stuck in the past as well. It makes it easier for conversation purposes to just assume the role they've designed for me, though. Frankly, I have no problem with turn based games, and this conversation isnt' even REALLY about turn based vs ARPG in the first place.
It's fundamentally about people wanting things not to change versus people who don't mind change. Lot's of people getting caught in the wake, but that's what it is at the core. This *does not* mean that turn based itself is a relic of the past. It means that the feeling people are trying to capture is, if that makes any sense.
So, there will be plenty of people that aren't so averse to change that will get caught up in this on the anti-ARPG side even though they aren't, as well as plenty of people (like myself) who very much enjoyed the old way that are also just plain excited about whatever comes next. All in all, though, it's all silly because here we are, like it or not. Personally, I'd recommend just going with it, as a general rule of life. Things change all the time.
It's fundamentally about people wanting things not to change versus people who don't mind change. Lot's of people getting caught in the wake, but that's what it is at the core. This *does not* mean that turn based itself is a relic of the past. It means that the feeling people are trying to capture is, if that makes any sense.
So, there will be plenty of people that aren't so averse to change that will get caught up in this on the anti-ARPG side even though they aren't, as well as plenty of people (like myself) who very much enjoyed the old way that are also just plain excited about whatever comes next. All in all, though, it's all silly because here we are, like it or not. Personally, I'd recommend just going with it, as a general rule of life. Things change all the time.
High production values is what has allowed it to survive and keep going. It's practically the reason why Final Fantasy VII was a huge success when it first released and has been consistent with every other mainline entry ever since. Imagine a Final Fantasy game today with low production values and how everyone would react to it.
Final Fantasy is no different then any other AAA game today. People invest in a Microsoft and Sony home console to specifically play cutting-edge software because that's how both XBox and PlayStation brands are marketed. Consumers expect bigger and better and Final Fantasy is a part of that club.
Why are people so hyped for Final Fantasy XV? They're hyped because of how amazing it looks. From visuals to gameplay, the production values seem to be top notch.
I think as long as production values are at a high level, how Final Fantasy performs in the west should be fine. Doing different things then what previous Final Fantasy games have done I think is a non-factor. If change is good and it works well, then I would like to think that the number of people who will shit on Final Fantasy XV will be much smaller then the number of people we saw shitting on Final Fantasy XIII was.
That said, Japan is the concern here as mobile dominates that country and the home console market is garbage. They seem to value different things then the west does.
Final Fantasy is no different then any other AAA game today. People invest in a Microsoft and Sony home console to specifically play cutting-edge software because that's how both XBox and PlayStation brands are marketed. Consumers expect bigger and better and Final Fantasy is a part of that club.
Why are people so hyped for Final Fantasy XV? They're hyped because of how amazing it looks. From visuals to gameplay, the production values seem to be top notch.
I think as long as production values are at a high level, how Final Fantasy performs in the west should be fine. Doing different things then what previous Final Fantasy games have done I think is a non-factor. If change is good and it works well, then I would like to think that the number of people who will shit on Final Fantasy XV will be much smaller then the number of people we saw shitting on Final Fantasy XIII was.
That said, Japan is the concern here as mobile dominates that country and the home console market is garbage. They seem to value different things then the west does.
Is it really? I think there's a certain value in at least in partially recapturing the "feeling" (or "spirit", if you want a less personal term), but the way certain people want to go about it irks me. There is a - in my opinion, false - assumption going about that sounds like this, "'A' was part of this thing I liked back then, and now I don't like this thing anymore, so the lack of 'A' is clearly at fault", a postulate that is more brought up in video games than any other medium (see also: "There aren't any 'game overs' anymore"), but is a correlation that oversimplyfies things more often than not. (Of course, this is largely in relation to mechanics. Artistic context was always a matter of personal reception and the argument holds more strongly here.)
The point that I'm trying to make here is thus: There is no "formula" to "recapture feelings" and thinking that "element 'A' is prerequisite for emotion 'B' or a 'spirit' trying to be evoked" is preposterous. Any modernization may or may not do so as well and, depending on "player response", works or doesn't.
In the case at hand - FF XV - that means we have to judge the game on our own and who knows... maybe that "spirit" (or "feeling") isn't so dead.
The point that I'm trying to make here is thus: There is no "formula" to "recapture feelings" and thinking that "element 'A' is prerequisite for emotion 'B' or a 'spirit' trying to be evoked" is preposterous. Any modernization may or may not do so as well and, depending on "player response", works or doesn't.
In the case at hand - FF XV - that means we have to judge the game on our own and who knows... maybe that "spirit" (or "feeling") isn't so dead.